Shuck and Jive


Friday, May 20, 2011

Meaning of Life, Part 66

The contemprorary belief that science and technology have freed humanity from dependence on nature is thus a dangerous illusion. It's this illusion that leads so many well-intentioned people to argue that nature is an amenity, and should be preserved because, basically, it's cute. That sort of argument invites the response, just as stereotyped and more appealing to our culture's habits of thought, that hard-headed practicality takes precedence over emotional appeals and nature can therefore be ravaged with impunity.

Yet nature is not an amenity, and the "practicality" that leads people to ignore ecological realities typifies this sort of thinking C. Wright Mills called "crackpot realism," the use of rational means to pursue hopelessly irrational ends. If anything, industrial civilization is the amenity, and it's not particularly cute. Nature and humanity can survive without industrial civilization, but neither industrial civilization nor humanity can survive without nature--no matter how hard we pretend otherwise, or how enthusiastically we stuff our brains with fantasies about electronic reincarnation and the good life in deep space.

We have all grown up, one might say, thinking of nature as an adorable, helpless bunny that some people want to protect and others, motivated by the will to power that is the unmentionable force behind so much of contemporary culture, want to stomp into a bloody pulp just to show that they can. Both sides are mistaken, for what they have misidentified as a bunny is one paw of a sleeping grizzly bear who, if roused, is quite capable of tearing both sides limb from limb and feasting on their carcasses. The bear, it must be remembered, is bigger than we are, and stronger. We forget this at our desperate peril. pp. 16-7.

John Michael Greer, The Ecotechnic Future: Envisioning a Post-Peak World

It's Rapture Eve

And here is a song for it...

Time for Change: OK to Be Takei!

Tennessee has the national spotlight. It is hard to fathom the combination of ignorance and cruelty exhibited by some members of the human species. This was posted today in the Johnson City Press:
NASHVILLE (AP) — A measure that would prohibit the teaching of homosexuality in Tennessee public schools has passed the Senate.

Under the proposal approved 20-10 on Friday, any instruction or materials at a public elementary or middle school will be "limited exclusively to age-appropriate natural human reproduction science." Republican Senate sponsor Stacey Campfield of Knoxville says "homosexuals don't naturally reproduce."

Campfield says current state curriculum is not clear on what can be taught.

The companion bill has been withdrawn from consideration in the House. But its sponsor has said he will bring it up again next year if the Senate version passes.

According to the National Conference of State Legislatures, Tennessee would become the first state to enact such legislation if the proposal passes.

Opponents of the legislation say it would be unfair to students who have same sex parents.
Campfield said: "homosexuals don't naturally reproduce."

Just because a person is gay that does not mean that the equipment doesn't work.

What kind of people elect a person like Campfield?

I wonder about those 20 legislators who voted in favor of this. Are they as ignorant and cruel as Campfield or just so politically spineless that they cannot stand up against prejudice even when the psychological and social well-being of children is at stake?

I am thankful that many folks in Tennessee aren't just sitting around taking it. I am happy to announce a new support group for LGBTQ people and supporters between the ages of 17-22. The group is called
The Change and they meet from 6-9 p.m. for supper, socializing, and support on the second and fourth Saturdays at the Presbyterian Campus House at ETSU.

None of the high schools in the Tri-Cities even has a GSA (Gay-Straight Alliance), so three women decided to start one off-campus. While this age group is 17-22, there is a need for a younger age support group. Perhaps the success of this group will make that a possibility as well.

The group calls itself
The Change as in "be the change you want to see in the world." What is that change? Changing attitudes. Changing hearts and minds. Changing ignorance to understanding. Changing cruelty to compassion.

It is a tall order, but it starts with courageous people saying, "We have had enough."

The next gathering will be
Saturday, June 11th.

Here is the new website (still under construction) and contact information.


Celebrate
GLBTQ YOUTH/YOUNG ADULTS
SUPPORT GROUP

TO PROVIDE A SAFE, NURTURING AND CREATIVE ATMOSPHERE FOR THE GAY,
LESBIAN , BI-SEXUAL, TRANSGENDERED AND QUESTIONING YOUNG
ADULTS/YOUTH AND SUPPORTERS OF ALTERNATE LIFESTYLES OF THE
TRI-CITIES AREA.

6:00 P.M. TO 9:00 P.M.
WHERE: Presbyterian Campus House at ETSU
(1412 College Heights Road, Johnson City, TN 37604)

AGE: 17-21 years of age

This group will meet on the 2nd and 4th Saturday
of every month.

For more information:
Email us at

JCGLBTQ [at] gmail [dot] com

Or you may call Amy
423-416-5653

And you are going to love this.

George Takei has posted a very clever response to the Tennessee legislators with a plan for action!

It is OK to be Takei!


It's even OK to be Takei on Twitter and Facebook!


Thursday, May 19, 2011

A Cornhusker FLIP!!


The good news keeps coming in for Amendment A. It is getting support all over. The entire state of Alabama is on the justice train. Every presbytery in Alabama, North Alabama, South Alabama, and today Sheppards and Lapsley (by a tally of 80-52) approved amendment A!

But that's not all, Beloveds.

Nebraska, the natural home of many marine mammals...

FLIPPED for justice and joy. Homestead Presbytery voted 46-29 in favor of Amendment A.



Let's give those prairie dolphins an award!!




Finally, Los Ranchos voted today as well and voted no, 51-131. When it comes to the justice train, some parts of California are a few coaches behind Nebraska and Alabama it seems.

The tally is 94-69.

Yet to vote.

5/21
San Juan is going to vote on rapture day.


For those left behind to clean up the mess left by rapturd Christians, voting continues.




5/24
Missouri Union (31-48) Flip
Western New York (66-48) Hold

5/26
Peace River (62-83-1) Flip

It would be a joy to get two flips and a hold from that bunch.

Wednesday, May 18, 2011

New Book for Thursdays With Jesus



We are beginning a new book tomorrow for our Thursday reading group. The book is called The Long Descent by John Michael Greer. I spoke about it in the April White Spire and here. I will review chapter one via powerpoint tomorrow. So if you haven't purchased the book yet come to the discussion anyway! It is a serious book for serious times.

It does, however, sound a note of hope.




"The choices we make in our turn, the insights we achieve, and the stories we choose to tell in the twilight of our own civilization have the potential to build foundations for the cultures of an age not yet born." p. 223





If you are near our mountain, join us from 10:30 until noon.

Tuesday, May 17, 2011

PCUSA Approves Gay Clergy And Thus Brings On the RAPTURE!!


Make sure you thank a Presbyterian for bringing on the Rapture. Now that Presbyterian pulpits will soon be overrun with gays, the Lord surely will return to save the righteous from gay cooties.

It appears the Lord will return Saturday, in fact.

More on that below.

First things first.

The voting on Amendment A continues. I had predicted that this was going to be the day we would get our 87th vote. I was proven wrong. Instead we received our 90th, 91st, and 92nd YES from

  • Des Moines, YES! 64-29-2
  • Charlotte, YES! 162-154-2
  • New York City, YES! 89-31-5
I think West Jersey was going to revisit whatever they did with their tie vote. Who knows.

The tally is 92-66.

Voting on Amendment A after it has been passed is like Hawaii going to the polls in the late afternoon on election night. However, it is good to get as many YESes as possible to show that this is the direction the church is taking. Hopefully, we will get 96 or 97 YESes.

Up next:

5/19
Homestead (37-40-3) Flip
Sheppards and Lapsley (77-75) Hold
Los Ranchos (35-143) Miracle Flip

Then guess what?

YES! It's the Rapturd!



Put your Rapture Bloomers on (so those left behind won't get a peek) and then you are ready to blast off and meet Jesus!


Don't forget your pets!

Sunday, May 15, 2011

A Tale of Two Toll Collectors: A Sermon

A Tale of Two Toll Collectors
John Shuck

First Presbyterian Church
Elizabethton, Tennessee
May 15, 2011

The Gospel of Jesus 13:5-10

Jesus also told this parable:

Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a toll collector.

The Pharisee standing by himself, prayed as follows:

“I thank you, God, that I’m not like everybody else, thieving, unjust, adulterous, and especially not like that toll collector over there. I fast twice a week, I give tithes of everything that I acquire.”

But the toll collector stood off by himself and didn’t even dare to look up, but struck his chest, and muttered, “God have mercy on me, a sinner that I am.”

Let me tell you, the second man went back home acquitted but the first one did not. For those who promote themselves will be demoted, but those who demote themselves will be promoted.

Robert Funk and the Jesus Seminar, The Gospel of Jesus (Santa Rosa: Polebridge Press, 1999), p. 63, Luke 18:9-14.


This parable as Luke has framed it and as the tradition has read it is about the contrast between humility and arrogance. The Gospel of Luke written many decades after Jesus died tells us how we are supposed to read it. Scholars, including the Jesus Seminar think that last line,
"For those who promote themselves will be demoted, but those who demote themselves will be promoted,"
is probably an editorial addition by Luke.

Luke begins the parable by telling us what he thinks was in Jesus’ mind:

Then for those who were confident of their own moral superiority and who held everyone else in contempt, he had this parable.
The issue with that reading is that it refers to types of individuals in the abstract. The Pharisee and the Toll Collector represent types with postures. One posture to emulate and the other to avoid. While that reading may capture some of what this parable might be saying, I think it misses a larger meaning. The parable may invite its hearers then as well as now to rethink some fundamental questions. These questions are:
  • Who belongs?
  • Who is inside and who is inside?
  • Who gets to interpret what the sacred texts say?
  • Who gets to speak for God and offer the redemptive mojo?
  • Who gets to decide of whom God approves and does not approve?
  • Where is the sacred?
  • Where is the holy?
  • Who gets shamed and who is honored?
  • How do our institutions participate in this honoring and shaming?
This parable is not about individual piety. It is a challenge to the legitimacy of the religious power structures. William Herzog in his book Parables as Subversive Speech suggests that it is little wonder Jesus was crucified. A parable about personal piety won’t bother anyone.
Be humble and not arrogant!
Well, of course, yawn.
But a parable that exposes the illegitimacy of a sacred institution, that will get you in trouble.

When we read this parable we immediately think what a jerk is this Pharisee. Listen to his prayer:
“I thank you, God, that I’m not like everybody else, thieving, unjust, adulterous, and especially not like that toll collector over there. I fast twice a week, I give tithes of everything that I acquire.”
Even the most self-righteous busybody won’t say a prayer like that. You may think it, but to pray it out loud? If we say something, we say it in a more politically correct manner. We may say, “Bless her heart” and “There but for the grace of God go I.”

That is a matter of culture and tradition. The prayer of the Pharisee is not atypical. Similar prayers were found in the Talmud. Here is one:
I give thanks to Thee, O Lord my God, that Thou hast set my portion with those who sit in the Beth ha-Midrash and Thou hast not set my portion with those who sit in [street] corners, for I rise early and they rise early, but I rise early for words of Torah and they rise early for frivolous talk; I labour and they labour, but I labour and receive a reward and they labour and do not receive a reward; I run and they run, but I run to the life of the future world and they run to the pit of destruction.
From the Talmud’s point of view, this prayer is not self-righteous or boasting. The rabbi is giving thanks for the privilege to study Torah. Here is another prayer. We may wince when we hear it, but that is only because our attitudes have changed fairly recently that we do so.
“One must utter three praises every day: Praised be the Lord that He did not make me a heathen, for all the heathen are as nothing before Him (Is 40:17); praised be He, that He did not make me a woman, for woman is not under the obligation to fulfill the law; praised be He that He did not make me . . . an uneducated man, for the uneducated man is not cautious to avoid sins.” Scott, p. 95
The prayer of the Pharisee is a prayer within the framework of the rabbi who is grateful that he has been blessed with the privilege of studying Torah.

Our problem is that the New Testament and 2000 years of Christian tradition is already predisposed against the Pharisees. They are the foils against which the figure of Jesus is portrayed. They are the "bad guys" in contrast to the "good guy', Jesus.


We know the rest of the story. Jesus, rather than be seen as a Jew, a critic of his own religion, became a religion. The followers of this new Jesus religion called their book the “New Testament” over against the so-called “Old Testament”. This has led to a long history of discrimination and violence against Jews.

I think that if we are going to read this parable with meaning today, we need to read it not as a critique of Pharisees, the Temple, and Judaism. We need to read it as I think Jesus--within Judaism--told it, as a critique of his own tradition. In that spirit, we need to read it as a critique against our own tradition.

What is the critique?

If the Pharisee represents the institution’s favored son, the toll collector represents the outsider. The toll collector was a low-level employee of a Roman taxation system. It was a subsistence-level job of collecting tolls on behalf of toll contractors. These guys did the actual work and were thus the target for contempt.

A modern analogy today might be telephone solicitors! Everyone hates them. But they are simply the public voice of the corporations that pay them (and don’t pay them much) to hassle you at inconvenient times. We pour our contempt on the phone solicitors, but the hidden ones, the ones making the profits off of these sales, we never see or hear.


Toll collectors were the visible representation of Rome’s oppression. They were as much oppressed as anyone else. Herzog writes of them:
“The toll collector was a convenient target for the Pharisee’s assault, for he was poor, socially vulnerable, virtually powerless, and without honor. A pariah figure considered an “extortioner,” a “swindler,” and an adulterer of God’s law.” P. 188.
A lot of bad names right there.

The Pharisee is an upstanding citizen. He would be the guy everyone would want in their church. We mistake his prayer for arrogance. Bernard Scott says that
“He has only done what the temple map requires of those on the inside.” P. 96
This is the map. This is the way the institution is set up to evaluate insiders and outsiders, good and bad. This may be a first century Jewish map, but we could make our own map. John Dominic Crossan who was a Catholic monk before he left the order, said this parable could be modernized by saying,
“the pope and a pimp went to the church to pray.” P. 94
You can make this contemporary. Who is in and who is out within the Church, for example, today?

The scandal is at the end of the parable when Jesus says that the toll collector is acquitted and the other not. The outsider is in. According to Scott:
“The map has been abandoned. It can no longer predict who will be an insider or an outsider.” P. 97
Scott goes on to conclude:
“This parable subverts the metaphorical structure that sees the kingdom of God as temple. Given this metaphorical system, things associated with the temple are holy and in the kingdom, and things no associated with the temple are unholy and outside the kingdom. In the parable the holy is outside the kingdom and the unholy is inside the kingdom.” P. 97
For Scott, this parable takes to task the institution that legitimizes insider/outsider roles. This is true for the 21st century Christian situation as it was for the 1st century Jewish situation.
In our parable the toll collector stood far off because he was ostracized for his impurity. The Pharisee stood apart probably because he didn’t want to brush against anyone unclean.

He is too clean for the group. The toll collector too unclean, so both stand apart for very different reasons. One stands apart because he is considered a deviant shunned another because he is prominent. This has nothing to do with their individual characters, but with their roles in the institution.

In a sense they are both toll collectors. The toll collector in our parable is a functionary in the Roman system, but the Pharisee is a functionary to enforce the collection of tithes for the temple. That is his big brag. He tithes for the Temple. He collects and promotes this institutionalized system that divides insiders from outsiders.

One of the roles of those within legitimizing institutions is to make and enforce social rules. Who decided all of this clean and unclean anyway? Norms and rules are created to decide who is in, who is out. It is done in a way to further one’s own interests. The enforcement comes in the public enactment, the spectacle of ritual.

This parable is the spectacle of ritual in which the legitimizing figure of the temple, the Pharisee, enacts a ritual of honor and shame to reinforce the temple’s order. We are right with God. We are the blessed ones. The best way to reinforce that is to single out a scapegoat.

The Pharisee publicly shames the toll collector.

Herzog invites us to imagine the scene:
“If the toll collector has stood far off to remain inconspicuous, the Pharisee stands apart to be conspicuous. At the precise moment that the officiating priest is entering the Holy Place to burn the incense, and at the very moment when the people believe the prayer to be most efficacious, the Pharisee steps forward and prays aloud.” P. 186
And what does he pray so the crowd can hear?
“I thank you, God, that I’m not like everybody else, thieving, unjust, adulterous, and especially not like that toll collector over there. I fast twice a week, I give tithes of everything that I acquire.”
Herzog writes:
“The Pharisee has proclaimed his honor while shaming the toll collector.” P. 186.
But it isn’t just about the Pharisee.

It is a spectacle of ritual. It is designed to enhance and reinforce the legitimacy of the Temple and its rules for who is righteous and who is not and what it takes to stay on the righteous train.

What is the toll collector supposed to do now? In order to fulfill his role as the unclean, he needs to slink away in shame. He needs to recognize his place in the scheme of things and leave. Thus the institution will remain “pure.”

Here is the scandal.

The toll collector does not go away.

Neither does he accept the labeling of the Pharisee. Nor does he appeal to the institution and its priests for redress. Instead he speaks directly to God.
“Have mercy on me.”
This is how Herzog puts it:
“If the toll collector had followed the script, he would have left in silence, a shamed man put in his place. But he does not go quietly. Having heard the worst that the Pharisee could throw at him, he cries out, beats his breast, and prays for mercy, the very mercy being made available through the afternoon sacrifice. He refuses to consent to the Pharisee’s shaming but appeals to a higher source. He refuses to accept the labels attached to him, the stigma of toll collector, but speaks directly to God, seeking mercy. He breaks the deafening silence that followed the Pharisee’s effort to reinforce the status quo. He breaks through the intimidation and fear that the Pharisees words have created, and by his actions, he challenges the Pharisee’s reading God’s judgments.” p. 192
Herzog goes on to say:
“The parable provided a model of a figure who refused to be silenced but found his voice in the process of discovering God.” P. 192
This is not a parable extolling pious humility. It is a parable of a person who claims his humanity and his place before God when denied that place by the institution that is supposed to act on behalf of God.

I am going to say that again.

This is not a parable extolling pious humility. It is a parable of a person who claims his humanity and his place before God when denied that place by the institution that is supposed to act on behalf of God.

The institution said, “No.” But he stood his ground and waited for what God might say. The punchline of this parable is that the toll collector was right to do so.

Jesus said ”Yes” to him.

This past week the Presbyterian Church finally ended 33 years of official legitimization of discrimination against gays. Gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender people have been treated as modern toll collectors by the church. Through the ritual of spectacle, preachers and those who represent the religious institution have vilified, ostracized, and labeled as sinners God’s children. They have abused sacred texts and traditions to do so.

The institution of the Presbyterian Church did not take this recent action because it is nice.

It did so kicking and screaming. It was forced to do so because of courageous people who stood their ground and prayed to God,
“Have compassion! See us for who we are.”
In 1973, when I was eleven, a man named David Sindt stood up at the Presbyterian General Assembly with a hand-lettered sign that read,
“Is anyone else out there gay?”
Thus the movement for justice began in this institution, the Presbyterian Church.

I celebrate today, 38 years later, not the church, but the courageous people like David Sindt and the cloud of witnesses who have followed his example of breaking the silence.

Amen.

Saturday, May 14, 2011

Boise FLIPS!


We are still keeping track of the votes for Amendment A. The more YES votes now means the harder to justify going back to bad, discriminatory ways.

The good news today is that the Presbytery of Boise did a FLIPPER, 37-27!




Let's give Boise an award!






Boise is the 20th presbytery to FLIP from a no to a YES.

The tally is 89-66.

Hoping to get the YES vote up in the mid to high 90s.

Let's keep at it, beloveds.

Next up:


5/17
Des Moines (52-37) Hold
Charlotte (133-124) Hold
New York City (76-25) Hold
West Jersey (88-80) Hold
Shenango (4-101) Miracle Flip

Amendment A in Johnson City Press

Madison Matthews of the Johnson City Press wrote an article contrasting the views of three clergy in our area regarding the changes in the PC(USA). Decision Divides Local Presbyterians.
Although the Holston Presbytery voted against the amendment in December, the Rev. John Shuck of First Presbyterian Church of Elizabethton, lauded Tuesday’s decision as a major step forward for the way the church has historically handled the issue of responding to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people.

“Our church’s reaction has most of the time been negative, so taking out official statements that are negative really is important to do, because now we say we really are open and inclusive to people,” he said.

While the new statements don’t outright acknowledge ordaining gays and lesbians, Shuck, an advocate for gay rights since the late 1980s, said the amendment has the practical effect of opening that up to those who may have been waiting for that to happen.

“If you’re going to invest yourself to go through college and then go through three years of seminary, you kind of want to be able to know that you’re going to get a call, and if you’re gay or lesbian that hasn’t been very certain. In fact, it’s generally been negative,” he said.

For the Rev. Louis Imsande of First Presbyterian Church of Johnson City, this decision has more to do with the current church’s views on sexual immorality and temptation.

“Culture is very accepting of different sexual practices, but what the vote was was to remove from the Book of Order the vow that ministers make that says you will be celibate outside of marriage and chaste inside of marriage,” Imsande said.

Replacing language that makes it more accepting in terms of sexual wishes and desires goes against what the Bible teaches, according to Imsande, who voted against the adoption of the amendment.

“I understand the people pushing this through are more on the side of the LGBT’s side of the house,” he said. “The problem that is going to ensue now is that in the more liberal presbyteries, like the Minneapolis one or one in Atlanta, they will be quick to ordain folks who are homosexuals, but then you have your presbyteries like the one here, which is a conservative presbytery, who won’t accept that calling.”

What this creates, according to Imsande, is a larger issue of disunity within the church as a whole. With what Imsande sees as a “watering down” of the ministerial vow, this decision is a step backward for a denomination that was already hurting.

“We’ve lost a lot of large churches and now the process is speeding up to where more churches will leave the denomination,” he said. “The Presbyterian Church used to be a flourishing denomination where we were fairly focused on the calling of Christ. Rather than a Christocentric denomination, we have become an issue-driven church rather than being concerned about the larger issues that are following Christ and spreading the gospel.”

Shuck agreed that the installment of a gay minister within the local presbytery would likely be difficult, but he hoped the decision was a reflection of a larger form of acceptance and change going on in the culture.

While some opponents might say following culture instead of the Bible is the wrong move for the church, Shuck said he believes the Bible can be read many ways. He looked to the abolitionist movement as an example, saying abolitionists had to go against many passages in the Bible that didn’t condemn slavery.

“The culture changed and our reading of the Bible changed and our reading of theology changed. In other words, we’ve adapted. The same thing with the role of women in the church,” he said.

Shuck said he doesn’t think this decision comes down to “culture vs. the Bible.”

“To put it theologically, I think it is a movement of the spirit that is moving us to open our eyes to see more light from the Bible,” he said.

While happy to see change begin to happen within the church, Shuck said he understands the decision will no doubt cause some congregations to leave the church, but he’s also hopeful more will join.

Rev. Allen Huff, Jonesborough Presbyterian Church, agreed, saying they’re all moving forward with the understanding that there will many people saddened and hurt by the decision.

“It will be a very painful change, of course. I’m not jumping and down celebrating, because it will be very, very difficult for people that I love very much, but we have been soul-searching and debating and talking about this issue for several decades now,” he said.

Huff, who voted in favor of the amendment, said there will be many congregations wrestling with what to do now, but he believes the decision was led by God.

“It’s a bold statement of faith. All that the church ever offers is a faith statement, and this statement says that God’s call is given to individuals with gifts for ministry,” he said. Read more
We may have differing opinions on this issue but we are not divided in terms of shared ministry. As I wrote in a letter to my congregation and my presbytery:
I am also aware that some in our presbytery disagree with this action by the church. Our congregation and I value our presbytery community. We are honored to take an active role in the ministries of this presbytery. We are committed to working on those ministries we share in common and to build relationships. We seek also to respect each other's freedom of conscience.
Our executive presbyter, Rich Fifield, posted this on our presbytery's webpage.
While Holston Presbytery (the district of Presbyterian Church (USA) congregations in upper northeast Tennessee) voted to disapprove this change to the Book of Order, we affirm the long-standing Presbyterian commitment to freedom of conscience and mutual forbearance when different convictions about issues threaten to divide us.
You can't ask more than that.

Friday, May 13, 2011

Amendment A in Elizabethton Star

This was in Friday's Elizabethton Star:

Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) Removes Barriers to Ordination of Gays, Lesbians

The Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) has struck down a requirement that unmarried clergy remain celibate, removing a key barrier for gays and lesbians who want to be ordained.

The Presbytery of the Twin Cities provided they 87th vote this week. Presbyterians endorsed the new policy last year at their general assembly, but needed ratification from the majority of its 173 presbyteries, or regional districts.

Rev. John Shuck, Pastor the First Presbyterian Church of Elizabethton, said, “This barrier has caused great pain for our church and in particular for lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender people, their family members, and friends. We have lost many excellent ministers and officers because of our discriminatory policies. This change is a major step forward in accepting the diversity and gifts of all people.”

The change will go into effect July 10th, 2011. The denomination has been wrestling with the ordination question since the mid-'70s. The Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) joins other mainline church bodies. The Episcopal Church, The Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, and The United Church of Christ is open to LGBT people for ordination.

Michael Adee, Executive Director of More Light Presbyterians, an organization that advocates for LGBT people in the Presbyterian Church said of this decision: "More people will be able to live the truth of their lives, parents will talk more about having gay kids and people will come out in Presbyterian churches."

Differences over the Bible and homosexuality have divided mainline Protestant groups nationwide and around the world.

A small number of Presbyterian churches broke away from the denomination ahead of Tuesday's vote, but no major split is expected right away.

The Presbyterian Church is based in Louisville, Ky., and has about 2 million members.

The First Presbyterian Church of Elizabethton, is one of five More Light Churches in Tennessee and is open to full inclusion of lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender people in the life of the congregation. The congregation is located at 119 West F Street in Elizabethton. Its webpage is www.fpcelizabethton.org.