Shuck and Jive

Wednesday, January 13, 2010

Sole Savior

The LayMAN has announced some distressing news:

More than half of PCUSA Presbyterians reject Jesus as sole savior

Yes, Dr. Scholl's continues to be savior of choice for Presbyterians' soles. This is increasingly true among specialized clergy as they are on their feet more often than their parish counterparts.

The blame should fall squarely on the Lord, however. He thought he was supposed to be soul savior.


  1. They really put their foot in their mouth this time, didn't they?!

  2. I'm a little surprised they want to advertise this survey, given how often they try to haul out the "Everyone but those danged lib'rul ministers agree with us! The people in the pews are on our side!" spin.

    But this is exactly the sort of bait that they can't resist.

  3. (Oh, and advertising the fact that 67 percent of pastors agree with the statement, “The only absolute truth for human kind is in Jesus Christ” wouldn't look good on their fundraising materials, so it isn't surprising that their article "forgot" to mention that.)

  4. Alan,

    I was thinking that same thing. I suppose this story is under the spin of how the 'cancer' of liberalism is spreading through the pcusa so the true believers had better secure the church property.

  5. ... secure the church property AND send the Layman money. Don't forget that second part.

    Actually I didn't think my first comment through fully. In fact, this cancer is spreading precisely *because* not enough people sent the LayMAN money, and this survey is the proof of that. If they're clever that's how they'll spin it for the fundraising appeal. (Plus with every $100 sent, you get a free commemorative millstone, autographed by Carmen herself. For $1000 she'll send it to the heretic of your choice with a gift card.)

    Note to LayMAN: If you use that idea, I get 10% of the take.

  6. There was a very good letter to the editor on the Layman page saying that they had misinterpreted the results. The question was not do you believe that Jesus is the only was to salvation but rather do you have to be a follower of Jesus to be saved.

  7. The LayMAN skewing facts to support their own narrative?

    As a member of the Lay Committee (I'm on the mailing list and when they quote membership stats everyone on the list is a member) I'm shocked! Shocked, I tell you!

  8. Oh dear! That means I'm a member too! Eeeks.

  9. The question was not do you believe that Jesus is the only was to salvation but rather do you have to be a follower of Jesus to be saved.

    I guess that clears things up.

  10. John

    My point was that the original survey asked a specific question and received data back from the respondents. The Layman then asked a different question and used the data to answer their question. To the extent that surveys are scientific this is one clear way that the data received cannot be used.

  11. That article irritated me too. The letter to the editor was way too kind.

    The Layman, being the right wing propaganda tabloid that it is, writes inflammatory headlines on purpose.

    No matter how much detail in the article "clarifies" the true story, what sticks is the headline.

    It's a cheap but effective trick.

    But it underscores an important theological distinction that needs to be made. When Jesus said He is the Way (etc), he said nothing about belief. The commonly held Evangelical doctrine is wrong in a very fundamental way. In what amounts to a self serving narcissistic interpretation, they think Jesus was talking about THEM.

    He was actually talking about HIMSELF.

    Jesus was saying that any person who "comes to the Father", does it because Jesus makes it possible. Regardless of their religious affiliation or lack thereof.

    And Jesus also said, whether you go with Mat 7 or Mat 25, that some will be admitted into the Kingdom without ever having recognized him.

    (it seems to me that according to Jesus, the only folks who don't get into the Kingdom of God are the religious bible thumpers...)

    The propagandists over at the Layman know this, of course. They are just playing to the masses for effect.

  12. Jodie

    You sound like C. S. Lewis here! In "The Last Battle" Aslan welcomes someone who believed in Tash because Aslan took his faith in Tash as faith in Aslan.

  13. And I agree he was more polite than necessary.

  14. I don't know, Bob. No matter how you parse it, it sounds like Christian exclusivism to me. I would answer no to both questions.

  15. BTW, there *WAS* a letter that criticized the LayMAN on their website.

    That's gone now. They've been doing that a lot recently, they'll put up a letter critical of them for a day or two then take it down.